Inconsistencies, Part 2
Did you have to take your shoes off in Ohio but not Colorado? Post all of your thoughts about Inconsistencies on this blog post. (Click here for Part 1)
Labels: Gripes and Grins
posted by Glen at
9:00 AM
Terrorists Evolve. Threats Evolve. Security Must Stay Ahead. You Play A Part.
Did you have to take your shoes off in Ohio but not Colorado? Post all of your thoughts about Inconsistencies on this blog post. (Click here for Part 1)
Labels: Gripes and Grins
posted by Glen at
9:00 AM
190 Comments:
If the TSA really and truly wants to cut down on the confusion, then perhaps they should ensure that the pamphlets they produce match the information on their website. One major example is the “Prepare for Takeoff – Permitted and Prohibited Items.” This brochure does not even come close to matching the HUGE list of items on the TSA website. Just giving this list a cursory look shows that the “Makeup, Medication, Personal Items & Special Needs Devices” listed on the website has been whittled down to “Medication and Special Needs Devices.” This only ensures that many flyers are having extremely expensive makeup and personal care items tossed in the “trash.” The “Food & Drinks” list did not even make it to the brochure. Travelers are relying on the data in these brochures when packing, but the brochures are poorly assembled. The TSA covers their butts by including the following statement: “The prohibited and permitted items list is not intended to be all-inclusive and is updated as necessary.” This statement continues on explaining that the TSOs have full discretion to decide whether an item is prohibited or not. SO FLYERS BEWARE – ANYTHING YOU BRING CAN BE DETERMINED TO BE PROHIBITED. I would really like to know what happens to all these items – even new, sealed products – that are “thrown out” by the TSOs. If you don’t believe me, then search in Google for “confiscated items” +airport. You will find numerous articles that show money is being made off these items – AT YOUR EXPENSE. Many of these items are being sold on eBay. I wonder, how many confiscated items did not even make it that far? Where’s the really good stuff – not just the knives and scissors?
The TSA needs to assemble ONE PDF file that contains ALL the information that a traveler needs to know for packing and flying. I have printed out 30+ pages from their website containing the required information. Some of it is duplicated from article to article, but I was unable to find ONE file that provides a traveler with the knowledge they need. I have the “Prepare for Takeoff – Permitted and Prohibited Items” brochure (2 pages) PLUS the expanded 8 page list from the website; “3-1-1 for Carry-ons –Prepare for Take-off” brochure (2 pages); “What’s New Basics” information regarding batteries (9 pages); 3 pages of the “simpliFLY” website section; 5 pages from the “Travel Assistant” section; and “New Policies for Lighters, Electronics, and Breast Milk” (3 pages). I am sure the TSA has at least ONE competent person on staff who could assemble all travel information into ONE PDF file that every traveler could then download and print when preparing for a trip. It would be much easier for the TSA to update ONE file than to update several webpages and brochures to make sure the data is consistent in all documents.
March 21, 2008 10:19 AM
re: I am sure the TSA has at least ONE competent person on staff who could assemble all travel information into ONE PDF file
What has TSA done to make you think they have a competent staff member?
March 21, 2008 12:39 PM
Thanks for encouraging dialog with the public through this blog!
This is a small point, but I can guarantee that thousands of hours of screener and passenger time have been wasted because of it. Some screeners are apparently unfamiliar with the details of some state driver's licences. My co-worker and I were just subjected to full searches at LAX because our older but valid driver's licenses were unfamiliar to all three of the screeners present. Maybe a simple photo booklet of various licenses would be of help to some of these more novice workers.
Thanks again!
March 21, 2008 11:06 PM
For all those complaining about inconsistencies...I'll admit that it is frustrating if when one group or location follows established procedures and another does not. However; do you not realize the value in inconsistent behavior from the security standpoint? Why on earth would we want to do the same thing, every time, every day? How easy would it be to observe, look for weaknesses to exploit, and beat the security? Our country is a country of spoiled brats.
March 22, 2008 2:17 AM
I travel often and have concluded that the 3 oz rule is silly. Please scientifically resolve the issue of toothpaste beyond 3oz as a real security threat. I went through a screening last week in Denver same time as a colleague. His 6 oz. toopaste made it through the screeen tucked away in his luggage while my 4oz tube in a clear plastic bag was pulled for trash. Enough already!!!!
March 22, 2008 12:33 PM
Why on earth would we want to do the same thing, every time, every day? How easy would it be to observe, look for weaknesses to exploit, and beat the security? Our country is a country of spoiled brats.
If TSA were doing it's job, then the terrorists would be caught. Screening for liquids, shoes, etc are pretty commonplace and as such should be standardized. If you are a TSA screener then I would suggest finding another job before you get fired for your bad attitude.
March 22, 2008 2:44 PM
I'm confused on the policies that cover carry on luggage. Recently, on the Detroit to Boston leg, the TSA in Detroit separated out the items I had in my quart size bag. the small tubes were place in a separate bag. Then, my my make-up bag was looked at. The TSA person separated out the items into 2 other quart size bags. So I figured that the rule was-a separate bag for different types of items. Remember, all I have is a carry-on bag for a short week-end trip. On the Boston to Detroit leg, TSA security at Logan Airport was very perturbed with me because I had THREE quart size bags with my items in them. I mentioned, (I suppose somewhat flippantly)talk to the TSA folks in Detroit! The TSA person said that he was being a nice guy letting me through-he could stop me from flying,(you know!!) Yes, I got the message only ONE quart size bag for my travel size toiletries. I made sure the make-up items were small size but they're in a make-up carry bag in the luggage of the carry-on piece. Was it a full moon or something?
What is the correct way to handle this problem?
March 23, 2008 10:17 AM
As a type 1 diabetic, I can take insulin and needles aboard. It does not escape my attention that it is all a person needs to kill with, inducing hypoglycemia in you normal folks. In other words, unless you want to prohibit all diabetics and large strong men from flying, there is no way you can force all potentially deadly things from boarding a plane.
Stop stupid inspections and start using common sense!
March 23, 2008 12:01 PM
Many TSA employees appear to be unfamiliar with TSA policies. After nail files and scissors were permitted, my wife's were nevertheless confiscated. Her suitcase lock, which was TSA approved, was nevertheless cut off--even though a nearby TSA plackard states such a lock to be acceptable.
March 23, 2008 4:44 PM
This statement continues on explaining that the TSOs have full discretion to decide whether an item is prohibited or not. SO FLYERS BEWARE – ANYTHING YOU BRING CAN BE DETERMINED TO BE PROHIBITED.
That one comment chills me to the bone. What if they decide to confiscate my laptop (company provided) or cell phone (again company provided) because they got a wild hair up? Would they give me a receipt? Where would it go?
I suspect the answer to the reciept would be no and that it would go into an ever growing pile of confiscated laptops to be sold on Ebay by a TSA employee interested in making a fast buck.
That one comment puts me on the offensive more than anything else TSA does.
March 23, 2008 7:14 PM
Anonymous said:
This is a small point, but I can guarantee that thousands of hours of screener and passenger time have been wasted because of it. Some screeners are apparently unfamiliar with the details of some state driver's licences. My co-worker and I were just subjected to full searches at LAX because our older but valid driver's licenses were unfamiliar to all three of the screeners present. Maybe a simple photo booklet of various licenses would be of help to some of these more novice workers.
Point of fact, these books are generally available at many airport checkpoints, for screeners to use. Either they are not available at LAX (which I doubt) or the screeners did not bother or think to reference them.
March 24, 2008 10:51 AM
Why is it that the TSA required that Continental not accept online boarding passes at San Jose (SJC)? That meant that all online boarding passes had to be exchanged at the gate, which was a waste of time and resources.
The proffered reason was that Continental did not use a gate reader. Well Continental and other airlines don't use gate readers at many of the airports they fly to. Clearly, this was an anomaly compared to the rest of Continental's system, and Continental agreed the policy didn't make much sense.
This procedure has now been changed just very recently, but only because it was brought to Continental's attention and they worked to get the restriction lifted.
Answers? A rogue station?
March 24, 2008 1:47 PM
I have a metal knee, and so am subject to additional screening each trip to the airport (twice a week). Fine. But that process has no consistency. Some screeners are so focused on getting their little memorized speech out - even after I've sat down in "the position" ready to go, and pointed out that I do this twice a week - that I swear, I could be wearing a rubber clown nose and standing on my head and they wouldn't notice. Can you just make these folks.....I don't know, smarter?
March 24, 2008 3:27 PM
Frankly, I felt much safer flying around Nicaragua out of Nicaraguan airports last month than I did in US airports. This despite the dire US Govt warning that Nica airports "did not meet US government security and safety standards." The Nicaraguan security personnel were both far more polite, and far more thorough than US TSA employees.
Sure, at every Nica airport there were always a couple grim-faced folks wearing fatigues and carrying AK-47s watching your every move, but the security screeners showed impeccable courtesy and customer service, unlike the cattle-drive, body-cavity search TSA screamers I encountered at both DIA and IAH.
At the Nicaraguan airports, no matter how tiny, both my carry-on laptop bag and camera case were inspected meticulously---every little compartment unzipped, every SD memory card popped from its plastic holder, every ziploc bag with camera or computer gadgets opened, and even my tiny plastic earplug box (for snoring roommates and loud boat and plane motors) opened and inspected. Plus a third (!) surprise carry-on bag inspection right on the jetway boarding the flight from MGA to IAH.
All the while with all the polite, bilingual Nica screeners saying "We're very sorry sir, but we do need to inspect your bags. Is that OK? (well, of course it's OK, your buddy has an AK-47). Did you enjoy your stay? When you get on the plane back to Managua, be sure to get a seat on the left side of the plane, so you can see the lake and the volcanos. No glass bottles on the plane please, but you can pour your beer into a plastic cup and carry it on that way...." and so on.
The only polite US homeland security person I met the entire trip was the immigration agent at IAH. Every TSA employee was very gruff, very bored and most were downright rude. The TSA screamers I ignored completely, which seemed to make them more rude. Sorry, I don't even acknowledge screamers.
Send the entire TSA staff to any private-sector, company customer service seminar, and make them pass the final exam. Their inspections of my bags were cursory and useless, and their attitude bad. That compared to the 'sub-standard security' Nicas, who went over my bags with a fine-toothed comb while treating me like an honored guest in their country.
March 25, 2008 3:48 AM
To the passenger that has metal knees and is upset that he must listen to our "memorized speech" each time they are screened. It is listed in our Standard Operating Procedures that we recite that narrative and ask those questions prior to all screenings. The TSO's are only doing what is required of them, those that are not doing it, if identified, are subject to discipline. While I agree with you that seasoned travelers should be spared some of the "tediousness" of the recitations at the beginning, it is a part of the complete process, not a matter of making the TSO's as you put it, "smarter".
March 25, 2008 10:37 AM
Well lets talk about sitting in an airport waiting for my delayed flight and watching a woman and her two daughters kniting with 12-18 inch long wooden, plastic, or metal needles!
What the heck! I can see this as an issue or because they are women and may not be that strong to stab someone with these?
You will take a toe clipper away or a swiss army knife with a 1 inch blade but not some 12-18 inch needles with a point?
What about this?
Also I love the baggie idea; lets put all my liquids and gels in a baggie and still have it go through a second time. Oh this is not because you have less than 3.2 oz of a liquid but you need to make sure the container doesn't have more than 3.2oz printed. I have taken my toothpaste tube which is rolled up to maybe have an ounce of toothpaste but it was in a larger 4oz tube and was taken away. Go figure!
March 25, 2008 10:37 AM
I love the headlines on the www.tsa.gov web site: TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency.
March 25, 2008 8:23 PM
To Anonymous who said “While I agree with you that seasoned travelers should be spared some of the "tediousness" of the recitations at the beginning, it is a part of the complete process, not a matter of making the TSO's as you put it, "smarter".”
If the policy is dumb, then the policy is dumb, and in this case the policy is dumb. People who make such policies need to understand that the traveling public and TSO agents are grownups not five year old children.
The goal of the TSO agent should be to protect the public rather than to follow a bunch of dumb policies. If this were the goal we wouldn’t see TSO agents confiscating gummy bears from children, frisking immobile 90 year old women, requiring frightened, crying toddlers to walk through the metal detector alone, harassing frequent travelers who have flown thousands of times through hundreds of airports, and all the other absurdities we frequent travelers have observed.
March 25, 2008 8:57 PM
To Anonymous who said “Our country is a country of spoiled brats.”
It would certainly be easier for the TSA if we were as docile as citizens of totalitarian regimes. Fortunately we still have a little spark to stand up for our ever-shrinking civil rights. Fortunately we can still look at a nonsensical situation and do something to make it better. Unfortunately some people prefer totalitarianism -- at least until they experience it.
March 25, 2008 9:05 PM
I couldn't agree more about the inconsistencies, though it does make sense to vary the routine to throw the bad guys off.
I pride myself on keeping informed about all the policies. In spite of reading all I could prior to a recent leisure flight, I found nothing to let me know if something like a small box of dry cereal was allowed, or cheese crackers, or anything edible (but not liquid). Because I had a concern about potentially taking a computer hard drive, I actually spoke to a nice man at the TSA, who assured me the snacks would be ok.
It is my understanding that having larger containers could potentially give evil doers space to mix chemicals and create trouble...so I understand that as well.
I was annoyed, at CLE, that seating available prior to entering security areas were removed. I prefer to sit down and pop on some disposable shoe covers over my socks so I don't have to walk on the germy and dirty floor.
When I returned from MCO, it was very busy and crowded, yet they did not have all the stations covered for the screenings. I paid very close attention to the signs and announcements. In CLE I was NOT required to take the quart bag out; nor was any mention made in MCO. Previously in MCO someone was repeatedly holding a 1 quart bag and telling people in line to have it OUT. This time nobody was saying a word about the bags, only about computers etc. So, my 1 quart bag, which was ready to be pulled if I needed to, and was right on top in my carry on, was inside it, and as I made my way through I was asked if the tote bag was mine.
While it was nice to know the TSA appeared to be doing it's job, it infuriates me when people poke around my stuff. And I had to look like an ignorant dummy.
OK, so be inconsistent airport to airport, but for crying out loud, inform us prior. No reason why there can't be a rolling sign with the messages repeated consistently as to what to do while in line.
It takes me five hours to drive to Toronto, but it made me appreciate all the more the civility of not dealing with this nonsense.
And by the way, I understand many folks who use the Disney Magical Express bus...they basically hand over their suitcases, so that the ARE out of their control for the duration...and how do THEY answer the questions when going through security or handing them over to airline personnel?
March 25, 2008 9:29 PM
We recently went BOS to LAX and back. The TSA person at LAX insisted that everyone was entitled to one plastic bin at the line. then when people had laptops or children, she appeared to make other rules causing confusion and delays.
The TSA officer's arbitrary one bin per person didn't make sense and created confusion as no one was familiar with it (and was thinking this is ridiculous). There are stacks and stacks of plastic bins, let folks use as many as they need and don't make up bin rules on the fly. Let's get the lines through as efficiently as possible and let folks get their items through the scanner the way they can. The runner for the bins can certainly handle running stacks to the back of the line.
Thanks for listening. This was in the LAX Midway terminal on Friday February 29 2008 around 10 AM.
March 25, 2008 10:17 PM
For a little less confusion: About Liquids, for Screening Officers and for Passengers
There is one good rule of thumb;
If it:
POURS…SPREADS…SQUEEZES. or.. SPRAYS
Then it is a liquid, paste, creme, lotion, gel or aerosol.
Jelly Bellies, grapes and crème-filled chocolates are ARE NOT liquids,
yogurt IS.
Once you determine if it is considered a liquid then at least two regulations do apply:
1- the 3.4 oz rule (that is per item and per the label, not how much is in the container
2- (Non-medication) liquids must be in a 1-quart zip top bag for you carry on.
Anything larger than 3.4 oz per the label, must to go in checked bags.
If you have liquid medication, it is best to take it out of the carry on and place it in a bin to be x-rayed separately.
If you have questions, you may ask for a supervisor at any time.
The Liquids guidelines are posted on the TSA. Website at www.tsa.gov and on signs or flyers at the airports.
Pepper spray, mace and little pocket knives are NOT allowed in carry on bags or on your person! Read the signs carefully at the checkpoint.
TSO Lori
March 26, 2008 3:15 AM
I am a TSO at an airport that is not listed on this blog and regardless of what you tell the passenger or show the passenger they still say they didn't know about the rules and regulations. So by saying that we need to provide a brochure with detailed instructions would be ridiculous. They will still tell us that they "were not aware" of the limits for the liquids. I think that if they want more information they can get it from the website. Our lists change quite frequently so that is why they don't have the brochure, although you have a good idea, it is just not practical.
March 26, 2008 1:05 PM
I play darts casually, and have been known to be absent-minded. I also generally try to avoid checking baggage when flying for short-stay trips, for obvious reasons. I recently flew from LAX to SLC for a weekend with family. On the return journey, I discovered that I had failed to remove my darts from my bag before leaving LAX. Yes, the darts had gone through security with nary a murmur at LAX, but at SLC, they were spotted. I was allowed to mail them to myself, which is fair enough since darts are a prohibited item. Strictly, I should not have been able to carry them from LAX to SLC, and next time I shall make sure that I do not attempt to.
On the return flight, I was going through security at the same time as a relative who was flying to OAK. In his carry-on, he had a gift which he had been given while in Utah: a letter opener. I cannot understand why my darts, with less than 1.5 inches of pointed tip and of a shape completely unsuited to attempted use as a weapon, are unacceptable while a letter-opener with a six inch long, pointed blade and a handle which makes it ideally suited to be used as a stabbing weapon is perfectly OK. If someone is able to explain this inconsistency, I would be very grateful.
March 26, 2008 7:21 PM
TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency.
Sort of like a drowning man grasping at straws? When you have as much bad press as TSA does, you go for whatever puts you into the 'I done good' column, if just for a few moments.
March 26, 2008 9:10 PM
Anonymous said...
"I love the headlines on the www.tsa.gov web site: TSO finds firearm at Honolulu International Airport, and Brass Knuckles and Derringer found at LAX airport. Turns out the firearm, without ammunition, was improperly packed in checked luggage, the brass knuckles were a belt buckle, and the Derringer was a lighter. This type of sensationalism reminds me of a super market tabloid rather than a serious agency."
ANONYMOUS NEEDS TO BE AWARE of the fact if TSA didn't inspect these things, that some smart aleck is going to try to 'see if he/she can get a real one onboard by claiming it to be a fake'. I amsure TSA has thousands of reports about people "who tried to get a real weapon in, just to see if they could"
AND,..if you rob a bank with a fake gun, it is an 'armed robbery' just the same.
TSA is perfectly justifed in checking this stuff out. I want my children, grandchildren their grandparents to fly safe.
YOU cannot gaurantee that for me, but atleast TSA is making the effort. It is commonplace in our society to 'stand by and watch' an injured person and not help. I for one, do jump in and help, and so does TSA. There are those that "do" and those who "watch" them do it. If you don't want to be part of the solution, then you really should stay out of the way of those who do, and not be so judgmental. Who are you going to blame if (God forbid) the bad stuff happens again? I am pretty sure you are the kind who would blame TSA telling them they 'weren't doing everything' they could, right after you just told them they were looking to hard.
March 26, 2008 9:38 PM
Any comment on the latest inconsistency: forcing a woman to remove piercings, when TSA policy permits a private pat-down screening instead?
March 27, 2008 9:02 PM
I'd like the woman in Lubbock, TX (complaining about unfair screening) to view this video clip and then see if she still feels she was unfairly screened: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUdUEOVdEuc
This clip, albeit in a different part of the world, shows just how real a suicide bomber can be - in everyday life. If you don't like to be screened - (1) wear stuff that doesn't alarm, (2) drive yourself if you have time and energy, (3) take the train or bus. Terrorism a real part of all of our lives - we must learn to live with it and learn to tolerate those who are trying to keep all of us safe on a daily basis. As Tom Ridge said at the beginning of TSA - We need to be right a million times a day and the terrorists only need to be right once. May God Bless us all and keep that ONE out of our skies.
March 28, 2008 6:54 AM
I'd also like to ask the blog to comment on the post above about a woman being forced to remove her nipple rings
:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/03/27/nipple.ring.ap/index.html
This just makes no sense. A visual inspection or pat down should be sufficient and there should never be a need to force someone to remove their piercings. The TSA website states that a patdown should have been performed, why did the screeners not know this?
Really, this sometimes this seems less about security and common sense than causing as much inconvenience as possible to someone when the drones at the checkpoint see something "different". Whether it's a Macbook Air or a small piercing it's plainly obvious that it's not a security issue, so why do screeners insist on doing the most inconvenient and illogical thing possible?
Removing body piercings causes a great deal of inconvenience and in many cases will cause the loss of the piercing. It's not a case of simply reinserting the piercing, but having to go through the inconvenience and pain of having it done all over again and go through the several month healing process. Please, please please fix this issue!
March 28, 2008 8:23 AM
Anonymous @ 6:54AM
You said "Terrorism a real part of all of our lives - we must learn to live with it and learn to tolerate those who are trying to keep all of us safe on a daily basis. As Tom Ridge said at the beginning of TSA - We need to be right a million times a day and the terrorists only need to be right once. May God Bless us all and keep that ONE out of our skies."
You, sir, are either a stooge for the current administration or a complete idiot. The only reason "terrorism" is a part of our daily lives is because of the restrictions on civil liberties enacted by a completely incompetent administration led by a "president" that has less smarts than my Blackberry.
Unfortunately it seems there are more sheeple like you than rational folks, in which case a once great country will soon be ranked alongside other banana republics such as Zimbabwe. ANYONE that would quote Tom Ridge has clearly lost the plot. "OOOOH Run she has a NIPPLE RING". Bloody puritans.
March 28, 2008 12:41 PM
This is supposed to be about security, not judgments on body piercing.
It's plain and simple if a metal detector is set off (and most times body piercings do not set off detectors), then the TSA staff should verify that it is a piercing as claimed, verify that it is not a security hazard and allow the passenger on their way. This can all be done with a pat down or visual inspection.
There is not a single circumstance that would require a piercing to be removed to verify that it is not a hazard.
Any one (like the previous poster) that believes that we need to give up personal freedom in exchange for security does not deserve the privilege that the US Constitution brings and the honor of living in the US - go and find another police state to live in!
March 28, 2008 1:26 PM
Once again I'm so glad our airport has camera's. As a TSA employee I honestly can't believe the nipple story as true. No way in h.e .double hockey sticks would that EVER happen at my airport!!!!!!!!!!!!
March 28, 2008 1:35 PM
Camera's you say?
Bob/Christopher etc, is this nipplegate something TSA will look into? That was a very disturbing abuse of power
March 28, 2008 5:17 PM
I recently flew from Hartford to El Passo. This was the first time that I had been through security since I had a seven inch long piece of stainless steel put on my right leg. I walked through the "metal detector" and it failed to detect it. I told the security screener about this deficiency in the equipment, but he just shrugged and told me to move on. I FEAR that if I had had a gun strapped to my leg I could have brought it on board. What good is this time consuming process if it is subject to that kind of error and lack of concern.
March 29, 2008 10:59 AM
ok. with the lady that had to remove her nipple rings it is part of our procedure. we cannot resolve alarms such as that one simply by patting the area down or visualy inspecting the area as we are not allowed to touch or ask to view these areas. i also know personnely that it is only painful to remove the piercings if it was just pierced about a day ago or so. just like any other piercing such as your ears or your belly button the skin cannot grow in such a way that would make it hard to remove. it creates a fiscula a layer of skin that surrounds just the bar or part of the ring making a sort of tube for the jewelry to sit in.
March 29, 2008 5:56 PM
I believe most of the inconsistencies experienced at different airports come down to the number of arrivals and departures at any particular airport, i.e. Lubbock, TX. I predict that the piercing problem would never have happened at Las Vegas, Portland, Denver, even Phoenix.
I generally fly with two digital SLRs, extra batteries, portable hard drives, battery chargers, and three or four additional lenses. All of my departures have been from Las Vegas. Never have I been pulled aside and had my camera carryon inspected. Flying into and out of Portland, Orlando and Denver, no problems. However, each and every time I have flown out of Midland Tx (my home town), I and my camera bag have been pulled aside for additional attention, every item in my camera bag was wiped down for explosive residue and visually checked.
My thinking is that the folks in smaller airports such as Lubbock and Midland don't get much traffic with extensive carryon electronic equipment and such.
Having an implanted defribrilator and gone through pat downs in lieu of wanding, I will say that the TSA agents I have experiences have been most professional in their conduct and remarks.
March 29, 2008 6:23 PM
If everyday all the people you interacted with told you how stupid you are, or asked you how retarded you have to be to get a job like this, woulnd't you think you would start to get worn down after a while?? This is our job, we get up every morning and work an eight hour day just like you. So if it bothers you that we are void of emotion or care, why don't you try treating us with a little respect. The next time you feel like telling a TSO how dumb you think they are, pretend you are talking to your son, daughter, husband, wife, mother or father. Wouldn't it make you sad to know that someone you love was being degraded every day at work? We can't control the rules, we just have to enforce them.
March 29, 2008 6:25 PM
Would you all like some Cheese with that wine. I have seen far too many posts with people saying they intentionally bring stuff through security that they know is not allowed to see if they get caught. That is insane! Why would you want to do that knowing your going to cause a delay to yourself and fellow passengers. FOLLOW THE RULES! Sorry if you do not agree with them all but they are in place for good reason. Most of the STORIES in this blog are false. I read one story in the gripes and grins section where a woman said 3 TSO's pulled a gun on her and held it to her head because she threw her apple core on the ground. We do not carry guns! FALSE!
The next time you have a trip and your are taking a plane do some research on the net and try not to pack your brain with the rest of your belongings.
March 29, 2008 8:21 PM
I think you people complain way too much.
March 29, 2008 8:25 PM
My other half flew from Louisville to Baltimore to NH on Friday. Despite having to toss a full, unopened soda bought just outside the gates- TSA was the best part of his trip. They were polite, professional, in good humor (he took some good-natured digs from one of the guys about his Sox sweatshirt)and even apologetic about the length of the wait due to the multitude of families in front of him in line.
My last two flights (Louisville to Laguardia round trip and Louisville to JFK round trip) I found the same situation that he had on Friday.
I am flying to Orlando and back this week- I only hope that I have the same experience.
That said- the most rude, most understaffed and most inconsistant TSA folks we have ever encountered were at Boston Logan. We would rather fly into NH and drive than ever deal with Logan again.
March 30, 2008 5:43 AM
I feel that consistency is a bit over-rated. Yes, I want the list of items you can't take on the plane to be enforced consistently. But.. the methods of screening should be RANDOMLY exercised so as to keep people (terrorists) slightly on edge.
Example: I carry a LOT of paraphenalia within my computer case, including a couple of 15' ethernet cables that could rather effectively be used as rope. You'd think that much wire would cause someone to ask "Why?" One time out of 20, I think my case should be manually searched, but it never has been sinced they stopped the gate searches just before you get on the plane.
I support the idea of "inconsistency" as to who gets checked for what and when. It'd make me feel MORE secure if randomly a TSA agent took 3-4 minutes and asked (politely).. "You've got 2 hours before your flight, let's see what you're carrying today".
March 30, 2008 6:38 AM
I think there SHOULD be inconsistency in checks such as the shoe policy. I know that I'm a bit out of the mainstream here, but by having slightly different policies at different airports, you ARE making it tougher on the terrorists. By having a single rule that applies everywhere, you allow the terrorists enough time to figure a way around that rule.
By having SOME rules that vary location by location, or even better, if you applied SOME rules randomly by time or date, you make life more difficult for the people who are trying to "get away with something".
Believe it or not, there is a difference between an "honest citizen" and the 30% of folks that I've met in security who whine and complain about the rules.
Stop being so self-centered folks! By whining about the fact that there ARE various rules for security, you are saying that you consider yourself to be above those rules! This is the SAME thing that the terrorists feel - that the rule of law doesn't apply to them.
If you truly cared about security, you would integrate yourself into the security process.. you should be on the outlook yourself for security problems.
March 30, 2008 6:56 AM
Flying out of Detroit Metro,my wife and I were asked to remove our hooded sweatshirts. Good thing we had t-shirts on underneath. Secondly, has anyone ever seen a TSA official smile?
March 30, 2008 7:11 AM
I've had mixed experiences with security in various airports I've been to.
I would say a few dedicated lanes for those who are experienced travelers, a few for families & those with disabilities that need more time to get through would nice as well.
I've had some screeners be rude towards travelers barking commands at people to remove coats and shoes and have bags etc ready for screening. I would say some bigger signs up before security check points reminding people what to do would be nice for those who dont remember or don't travel much or first time travelers.
I've had screeners be very helpful and nice and get people through in an efficient manner others not so much.
I've been to Ireland, United Kingdom, Canada, and Denmark, and the security personnel in those places not only are helpful but make sure things go as quickly and efficiently as possible, and also the screeners are very polite as i am some airports have to screen so many people.
March 30, 2008 8:01 AM
Please improve the following:
1. Lines, time required to be at the airport prior to takeoff. Both TSA and the airlines have made flying a stressful and time consuming activity. I don't understand how both can be un-prepared for the number of people arriving at the airport on any given day. Both TSA and the airlines have a database of flights and how many people are on them for each day, so how come both can't staff the airport so people only have 5 minute waits at security and check-in. Small airports seem to do this very well, hubs seem unable to do this and always have long lines (even on days when their are no cancellations/problems). Clearly, they are just understaffed.
2. I have been treated rudely several times for not following inconsistent policies. One time I was yelled at by a TSA agent for taking my boots off (that it was not required today) only to then get up to the metal detector and have another say I had to take them off, when I politely mentioned what I was previously told, they only put me down and their co-worker. People are happy to comply and understand the rules do change, but either be friendly in stating what you want or post a sign at security arrival (I know it sucks to say the same think all day but hey that is part of the job).
March 30, 2008 10:21 AM
Would you please ask your employees to stop yelling at everyone in line waiting to go through security. I get really annoyed at the nazi storm trooper act that really doesn't produce any positive effect. Mostly I think you guys do a pretty good job and are generally well behaved and polite. I am also aware that there are idiots in every occupation, however, no one likes to be treated like cattle. Work on emphasizing a little more sensitivity and common courtesy in your training.
March 30, 2008 10:49 AM
FOLLOW THE RULES! Sorry if you do not agree with them all but they are in place for good reason.
I do obey the rules and still get grief from your TSOs.
Oct 2002 O'hare:
TSA gate inspector wants to remove medical tape on a 12 inch (30cm) incision to see staples (visible through translucent tape)
Numerous occasions unlocked tool chest given to TSA and locks either cut off, left off, or not relocked. Please tell me how this is my fault.
Laptop bag fully emptied (part of my job requires IT stuff)as a local procedure (O'hare again). Grey bin filled, top to bottom and front to back. Nothing but rudeness from TSO's.
TSA writing STUPID in permanent marker on the side of a coworker's tool chest.
Screamed at by bellowing/raging/R. Lee Emery wanna-bes.
Tell me how threats from TSA types make me safer. Please tell me how I can travel with tools (including IT equip) and have some assurance that it will arrive in one piece and secure?
Most of the STORIES in this blog are false.
Are the items I posted above false? You don't know. I do.
I read one story in the gripes and grins section where a woman said 3 TSO's pulled a gun on her and held it to her head because she threw her apple core on the ground. We do not carry guns! FALSE!
Perhaps this was a case where local policies allowed for a TSO to carry and project lethal force. When you have an organization with no built in controls you often have examples of outrageous behavior.
March 30, 2008 11:12 AM
My husband and I flew from Madison to NYC (LGA)this week for a professional conference. We had no trouble going through security in Madison. TSA employees are terrific here! When we fly we usually have a laptop, pda, cellphones, digital slr, many sd cards, mp3 player, and a portable dvd player. We take up a lot of bins. I also must carry medication with me and an epinephrine pen. No problems in Madison or any other city we've flown into or out of. However, at LGA they must have different rules. We must take DVD players out of their soft sided cases. Okay fine. We can do that. But when my husband, by way of apology, said to the TSA screener that we weren't used to that, the screener unloaded on him, yelling that this was policy at all airports and all of the other airports were doing it wrong. He was very rude and then another person joined in the bullying session. My husband, who is one of the nicest people I've ever met, kept his cool but was unnerved by the process. TSA employees in this particular city should be trained to be polite. We certainly didn't mind removing a dvd player from a soft sided case. We just don't think we should be yelled at.
March 30, 2008 11:14 AM
I fly twice a month, to work and home. I've noticed the TSO's make this up as they go. I spent many long years in law enforcement. So I know what and where they should look. And 90% of they time they do not look. Because their to busy looking to see what kinda clothes is packed, what interesting things are packed and so on. Every one knows or has seen the fresh rookie straight out of the police academy? With the attitude of I'm the law and you do what I say and when I say. Well I would have to say that about 95% of the TSOs I come across
try to or do abuse their power just to see if they can get away with it. They all need some interpersonal skills training. Just to watch they way they deal with passengers is disgusting at times. Their rude, and all the yelling that they do is very uncalled for. And they wounder why passengers act like they do. Try talking in a calm and lower tone with out the smart eleck remarks and you'll get a better response. No one like or wants to be yelled at.
March 30, 2008 11:17 AM
I would like to see the basics of the metal detector process outlined on signs to be read while waiting on line. Each airport is different in what they want. Some want all shoes off, others want certain shoes to be taken off. Some airports want a certain amount of items in the tub while others want shoes to go directly on the conveyer instead of in the tub. People would be more cooperative if they knew exactly what to expect as they were approaching the conveyer belt. While in Orlando one TSA screamed his head off at every person approaching the bag scan. He looked and sounded annoyed because he had to keep screaming the directive over and over again. A posted sign might have helped this unpleasant situation. That or a looped recording to save his voice.
March 30, 2008 11:51 AM
Dear TSA,
I travel around 26-40 weeks out of the year working for a technology company and part of my job is on-site support. As part of my job I am required to carry a small bag of tools to verify installs and correct minor OEM mistakes. My comment is in regards to the interpretation of the seven inch rule. 90% of the TSO's I interface with question the items I carry and I have to debate my way through the checkpoint narrowly clinging to my much needed tools. Every single one of those TSO's has a different take on what I should be able to pass through with and every TSO targets a different item as "dangerous" from screwdrivers to a crescent wrench? Yes! I had a 6.5 crescent wrench confiscated. I'm not quite clear on what threat that item posed, but they took it. I have lost around a dozen tools in the last year. Some were probably out of range for the 7 inch rule. Others clearly weren't. In bringing this up, when will you come up with a clear guideline for people who have to carry-on tools? The seven inch rule is generic and leaves it wide open to opinion. Maybe a little education with the TSO's on what to look for when it comes to tools would be great. Sometimes I come across a TSO who has zero idea what any of the items in my bag are and has to go get a supervisor who also has no idea what any of them are, and that slows things way down. I don't have an option of checking my bag everywhere I go because of my travel schedule, so it only leaves me with dealing with this option and when I have to waste 20 minutes at the checkpoint alone due to lack of education about the items I carry, it can send the frustration level skyward. In closing, it would be nice if you came up with a standard, policy, and clear guidelines for the end users on what will be accepted so I don't have to buy anymore tools and get held back gratuitously, it would be much appreciated.
Thanks,
Chris
March 30, 2008 11:55 AM
Hi there. I would like to say that I support the TSA and feel grateful that you guys are there to protect us. However, I do have two comments.
Firstly, I am a farmer from Hawaii. When I go to the mainland US I bring back small packages of seeds, the same kind that anyone can buy in a garden shop. The amount of seeds in any one pack is less than a tablespoon. Seeds are very sensitive to radiation. If you X-ray them, most of them will not germinate. Although most TSA screeners have been kind enough to let me through with my seed packets, there have been some who insist that my seeds must be X-rayed, which destroys them, wastes my money and kills living things. (Hey, I know it's not a dog or a baby, but if you were a farmer you might feel that way about your plants too.) Despite being told that the X-ray will kill the seeds, and my offering to open the packets so the inspectors can see that they are seeds, they refuse, and insists on X-ray. This burns me up. If I mail the seeds or put them in my checked bags, they are subject X-ray and to extremes of temperature that also will effect germination.
Could you please have some guidelines for seeds? If you policy is that they are not allowed, so be it, but I would like to request that you consider allowing so many ounces of seeds, especially if they are pre-packaged.
My second comment is about TSA employees' moods and attitudes. I'm a cheerful happy go lucky person (hey, I live in Hawaii). I smile and say hello. I treat everyone with politeness. I value good manners. I would LOVE IT if TSA would have regular workshops addressing putting forward a positive image to the public. Honestly, many TSA representatives seem to have a mood disorder, lots of gruffness and hostility, which is really unnecessary. I (we) pay their salaries through taxes, and I can tell you, if I had a farm hand who acted like that they would be given a chance to improve their attitude and if they couldn't, it would be the end of the line. I know they have a difficult and stressful job, and I appreciate all that the TSA representatives do for our country. But the agency has to make them realize that being polite, positive and cheerful will actually make their job easier and improve how they feel every day. It will also decrease attrition.
All that being said, I just want to say "Thanks" and "Aloha"
March 30, 2008 12:00 PM
I just wish the TSA screeners would follow their own rules. I was at an airport recently and I read all the signs posted while in line. The signs said that one did NOT have to take off one's shoes if they were flat. So I did not take off my shoes when I arrived at the pass throughs. I politely pointed out that there was a sign just a few feet away that said no shoes were to be taken off! Oh well, how sad that when passengers want to follow the rules they change on a whim. Now the screener did call someone to inform them of the sign but I heard a voice come over the radio that said "I don't care what it says" I think that is the key to all these problems, the screeners DON'T CARE!
March 30, 2008 12:42 PM
To the anonymous poster who complained about the "little woman" and her children being able to knit in the airport: Read the TSA brochure! They are allowed! Believe me, they are not pointy and really couldn't be used as a weapon, even by a strong man.
March 30, 2008 12:51 PM
I fly out of Orlando 3-4 times a year and they have there act together. Great overall job from an airport that sees thousands of tourist every day. I wish that was the same for Buffalo's airport. The first tsa agent is sitting on a stool and the expierance goes down hill from there. There is no effort on anyones part to speed the process. It seems like we are interupting there time. I have stopped showing my military id to the agents why? Because everytime i do they move me over to the side and i receive the frisk down. R they looking for safe people to check or potential terroists?
One comment about liquids. Why do people need to put liquids into the baggy to get past security when all they have to do is go to the bathroom and take them back out of the baggy? It is not the amount of liquid it is what the lquid is....
March 30, 2008 1:09 PM
I travel at least once or twice a week. I do not ask for any special treatment by TSA because of my airlines travel status. I have adapted to their regulations, restrictions and all of the idiosyncrasies at each of the various check stations at each city.
Believe it or not being prepared has made my travel experience more pleasureful rather than all the complaining you folks are doing. I get to watch so many of you bitch and complaint when for the most part it is your lack of preparation that causes the rest of those in line the biggest headaches and delays.
Now I don’t necessarily agree with all the regulations either. Some of them are a bit on the hair brain idea. But do you really know why we cannot take more than 3 ounces in a container and why it has to be in the bag. Believe it or not we are not privileged to all the reasons why our security has the regulations they have in place at any given day. We may not understand why they don’t make it more stream line. But we would want the next shoe bomb wearing idiot to have an advantage by “learning” the system of the screening process.
Those of you that are complaining here are the very same people that will be complaining and demanding where the security was when we have the next 9-11 event! Which is it going to be people? You cannot have it both ways. When you do have to travel don’t forget that the TSA personnel at the gates are only there to enforce the current rules. When was the last time you thanked the TSA personnel as you went through the screening process? They are doing their jobs.
March 30, 2008 1:57 PM
There are many inconsistancies. In Indiana we had to take off our shoes, but got to pick what line to go in (the shortest of corse), but then in Mexico we didnt have to take off our shoes, and there was a guy telling us what line to go in. He put us in the LONGEST line, and when we asked him, in Spanish even, he said we had to stay in the line we were assigned to. Talk about power trip! We nearly missed the flight! People behind us in the initial line were long gone, and us, yep still waiting to walk through the metal detectors. Someone please give these people standards and training. How are we supposed to know what to do, if nothing is consistant!!!!
March 30, 2008 2:08 PM
How many times in the process must a person show their boarding pass? I show it to the ticket agent and then I wait in a line to sow it to one TSA official before boarding a tram to the gates. After leaving the tram I wait in another line to again show my boarding pass to another TSA person
before going to the screening process. I then show it again to still another TSA person after going through the metal detector. Are all of the subsequent viewings of the boarding pass necessary just in case the previous screener missed it? It just seems like a huge duplication of effort. It just cannot be an efficient process
with all of this redundancy. This was in the Tampa airport by the way.
March 30, 2008 2:27 PM
Looking forward to my first Express Lane security screening; hope it works and that the "special" pass so one does not have to remove shoes, "jackets" (more on "jackets" later), etc. every time!
Why do some airports get to hide their going through you stuff when others will open right in front of you?
Why can't the TSA change gloves for every case? I know that the gloves are to protect them, but it turns my stomach to have my clothing and other personal items by filthy hands/gloves. Ditto for bins that are covered in gunk, and I set in my baggie or clothing to have it come out dirty!
Why does Chris at Jackson Hole know that, eventhough, he'll be reported for, literally!!!!, slamming my bag down onto the belt to the back, nothing will happen so a smug, condescending smirk and a "so what" response when I ask for his name?
Why 24 (yes, I counted) TSA sitting in IAH where they could see massive lines and checking their watches for the five minutes they have left? Then walking deliberately slowly to their stations. That day 2 hours in line; other days 1.5 hours. In the last four years have never been in that line less than 1 hour.
Why DFW has the most rude TSA? Want my story on my shoes disappearing for 30 minutes in DFW?
And, yes, the inconsistancies!!! Too many to even remember in the last 5-6 years.
Kudos to the crew at HDN except for the hidden examination table. Kudos to the crew at COD except their lack of continuous control of the bag once it has been searched (they sit on a cart that is not always w/in sight of the TSA). Kudos to PKB especially on the crack-of-dawn shift.
You really need to have some sort of set up in which someone can empty a baby bottle or a personal nalgene, etc. w/out leaving security altogether and w/out having to ingest the total contents.
March 30, 2008 2:38 PM
I do not understand why it is that the people that work at the Starbucks, etc and the flight crews can move to the front of the line at the check point. We are the customers, what happened to the customer is always right? It never fails that this happens to me when I am running late due for a flight normally because of long lines at the airport. Is there any other business that treats it's customers this badly? I spend approx 75,000.00 per year on flights.
March 30, 2008 3:00 PM
I'm sure you've heard this before, but I'm posting to increase the frequency of which you hear these complaints (and in case you haven't heard these).
I travel fairly frequently (I've boarded 20 airplanes so far this year) and there are several inconsistencies with TSA security check points:
- The sensitivity of the metal detector varies. Sometimes I get through with my belt on. Other times I have to go back and take it off...depends on the airport.
- Some airports REQUIRE that shoes are taken off and other don't. Of the airports that don't require the removal of shoes, sometimes the shoes trigger the metal detector and other times they don't (even with the same pair of shoes).
- Sometimes travelers are required to keep their boarding pass with them and sometimes they're not. This depends on the airport. The funny part is the TSA personnel don't seem to know that the rules vary by airport. They speak to travelers as if we should know their specific rules. My home airport is ORD. There's a woman there (I've seen her a few times) who gets annoyed at travelers that keep their boarding pass in their hands! I guess she gets tired of everyone trying to show her their pass. Not sure what the harm is. She could simply say thanks & have them move on. Instead she makes obnoxious announcements telling people to put their boarding passes away!
That's all I've got. I think everyone would get through security faster if they knew in advance that they must take off their shoes and belts, that they must keep their boarding passes in their hands, and any amount of metal (even high iron in the blood) could potentially set off the detector. I've gotten into the habit of always removing my belt and shoes, and keeping my boarding pass in my back pocket as I go through...just in case.
Thanks for listening! Keith Harrison
March 30, 2008 3:16 PM
TSA,
I travel 35-40 weeks a year and I have very few problems with the rules and regulations. The problem I have is with either incompetent, uneducated or power thirsty TSA employees. In Seattle, on a trip to Anaheim, I was asked about an itme in my carry-on. It was a 7 inch socket wrench handle. I had checked with TSA a few days earlier and confirmed that as long as it was no more than 7 inches, it was legal. When the agent pulled it out of my bag, he looked at it and said it was too long. I told him it was exactly 7 inches and that I had confirmed with TSA earlier that it was legal. He then took it over to a stand and held it up against something on the top of this booth and came back to me and said it was an inch and a half too long. I knew he was wrong and asked to see what "scale" he was using to measure it with. I was told I couldn't go into that area and I could either mail it or check the bag. I asked to see a supervisor and he told me he was the supervisor. I was furious but knowing you can't win that battle, went back to the ticket counter and checked the bag. When I arrived in Anaheim, I immediately went to a hardware store and bought a plastice ruler to measure the handle. Surprise, surprise, surprise!!! It was exactly SEVEN inches long. Now that's a reason you have furious passengers and why your agency cathes all the grief it does. We have no recourse against some power thirsty "wanna be a cop" mentality. The next time a situation arises and I know I am in the right, I will ask the local police (or port) authority to get involved and will file a complaint against the TSA individual.
Thank you,
Kirk in Seattle
ps If you would like to contact me:
NFLDeepSix@aol.com
March 30, 2008 3:16 PM
In your directions for the blog you say you expect people to be respectful in what they post. What about the TSA people being respectful of us? Most of them I have encounter in many airports are not respectful, they are rude, expect me to do what ever they ask, depending on what mood they are in, they treat me like I am a terrorist. There is never any kind of consistently from trip to trip of what is allowed and not allowed. Food should not be an issue, especially an unopened item, in plastic that is small. Or fresh fruit. So you take this from us so you can have lunch. There is no rhyme or reason. Flights are long and difficult and you would like to have a small snack. The food in airports is not what a healthy person whats, nor do I want to pay the high prices of food in airports. Sometimes you do not have time to buy anything in the first place. I sometimes think all of you are in this together so you can all profit from the terrorists. I in general do not have a problem with doing things to protect myself and others in this terrorist time of ours. But some common sense on a lot of this would go along way. I think you all have gotten way out of hand with your demands. I think it is a control issue on your part, lets see what we can get them to do today, next week or next month. One guy wanted my purse to go one way and me the other way, no way in hell, so you can steal something out of it. My purse does not get out of my sight and you should not expect anyone to let their personal belongs be out of their sight. I know someone that had something stolen from her bag, you know it happens more often than we hear about. This new deal about charging us to take the same amount of baggage for 20 years plus, we are now reduced to take only one bag. Is this for the airlines or for you all, or are all of you profitting from this? What does it matter if you take 2 bags, as long as things are not overloaded? Flying is a pain in the butt now on so many levels!!! And it does not have to be, everyone has just gotten way out of line on so many things. Passengers can not even say anything to you, or question you that you do not gang up together against the passenger that said something. I would hate to have a job like yours.
March 30, 2008 3:17 PM
I travel for business every week all over the USA and western Europe. Please answer me this! why is there so much inconsistency in TSA protocol regarding items allowed and removal of items? I'll travel through three different airports (in the US) on the same travel day and be required to do different things at all three airports (remove all electronics at one airport but only the laptop at the other...). Just when you think you understand and thus, prepare for the TSA requirements (which facilitates faster through put!), the TSA changes requirements.
My other frustration is to be in a long TSA line with maybe one or two lanes open but many TSA staff just standing around. Here's a concept, OPEN ANOTHER LINE!!! My job requires me to be as efficient as possible, why can't we expect the TSA to be functioning the same way? After all, we are paying for it! I think it's time for the bureaucrats to step aside (yes, I know, it's job security and it makes you feel important!) and let the TSA do the job they are designed to do!
March 30, 2008 4:04 PM